Fansub Review: [Doki] Kamisama Dolls (Episode 02)

B-Tier, Fansub Review — By on July 15, 2011 4:52 am

This post was written by Dark_Sage. He is Dark_Sage.

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Okay, yeah. This seems to be the best release for Kamisama Dolls.

File size: 355 MKV (HQ MKV), 199 MB (LQ MKV)

Japanesiness: Honorifics.

Karaoke.

Typesetting.

She was referred to as “your daughter” in the previous line. Using it here is redundant and hurts the flow of the lines. Try

“Is she doing well?”

Line was way too long for the allotted time.

Why is Seki capitalized and kakashi not? Seems like an arbitrary choice to me.

Protip: The same person can’t say two different lines at the same time. Fix your timing.

Italics for “do” to properly reflect how the accent on the word that would be used in natural speech.

She’s asking why the person who saved her didn’t report the fire. “I guess so…” is not a valid answer.

I know what they mean because I’m wapanese. But for those that aren’t, this sentene will read like shit. Redo it, kthx.

 

Overall grade: B+

The errors were mostly minor and irrelevant to the work as a whole. I see no reason to not watch Doki’s, unless you absolutely despise British English.

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15 Comments

Teal says:

> Italics for “do” to properly reflect how the accent on the word that would be used in natural speech.

It’s not necessary with that phrasing. A good sub should be (and in this case is) able to convey the lines without unnecessary visual cues. They make the subtitle stand out more and distract the viewer from the actual show. How many professional subs have you seen use italics?

Dark_Sage says:

You don’t use inflections in your speech? Where the hell do you live? Because it certainly isn’t in America.

In this case, the line’s meaning is still conveyed, but it can be read differently. If your mind doesn’t auto-correct the “do” to an accented “do”, then it simply won’t read well at all.

As for “professional subs”, I’m not sure what you’re talking about. You mean the subs they use for R1 releases? Or do you mean “high-quality fansubs”? Italics are not a rarity when it comes to anime.

Now, I often don’t pick on groups for fucking up natural phrasing by leaving out accented words (I’ve only done it a couple times), but based on what Caly was talking to me about, she’s more interested in improving her editing than sweeping all her mistakes under a rug of ignorance.

I feel that my suggestion is legitimate and would improve the phrasing of the line. And that’s why I included it, even though it’s not a severe mistake.

Teal says:

It’s not that I don’t use inflections in my speech, it’s that there’s no need for it to manifest in subtitles. Also, no, it’s not in America.

By professional subs, I mean the sort done by people who know what they’re doing, having done it for more than a decade as their goddamn job. Not being in America, there’s quite a bit of that to go around. Italics may not be a rarity when it comes to anime, but that doesn’t mean it’s right. The vast majority of TV is subbed here and it’s never occurred to me that the one thing they need there is italics. Italics sticks out very prominently in fansubs, along with such things as TL notes and honorifics (I mean, honestly, could you get on with actually translating the show rather than having half of the lines in Japanese?). I’m not just saying leaving it out is not a mistake, I’m saying putting it in is one.

Dark_Sage says:

1. I’m not going to look for advice from the people who have been doing subtitles for 10+ years. The people who have been doing subtitling for 10+ years are only professionals in the sense that a person who’s been making fries for 10+ years at McDonald’s is a professional chef.

Nobody wants to make subtitles professionally and it’s all outsourced or automated anyway. Try to watch closed captions in America. You can’t get worse than that.

2. If the vast majority of content is subbed in your country, your country sucks.

3. The italics improve readability and line comprehension. This is not something to be avoided. If you want your shows “pure”, then make sure to take out capitalization and grammar. Those things also only improve readability.

Teal says:

1. That’s like saying every restaurant in America is a McDonald’s. Wait, you almost have a point there.

Closed captions != subtitles. They serve different purposes. Closed captions is transcribed the audio for people with impaired hearing. I have watched English closed captions and yes, they’re horrid. Your subtitling industry doesn’t do much outside artsy French films and anime, because most of the media is in the viewers’ native language as it is.

2. Alright, that’s just stupid. Besides which, wouldn’t it improve our subtitling skills, you know, actually having something to sub?

3. Subtitles shouldn’t be noticeable. The objective for any media is to immerse the viewer/listener/what have you in it. People aren’t usually watching anime for the subtitles, they’re watching anime for its own sake and hoping the subtitles help understand things a bit more. Errors – grammar or otherwise – and needless effects draw away from that, making for a rather counter-intuitive translation.

Calyrica says:

Hey, now. No fighting over my editing!

I did indeed ask Dark_Sage to be extra harsh on his review, and he was. With the exception of the whom (which, ironically enough, if you demux the script, you’ll notice my comment of glee when I fixed a “who” to “whom” at another point) and the timing errors, that’s what it was.

So, I thank you, Dark_Sage.

Jukey says:

so does the “doki seems to be the best” take chihiro’s release into account?

NSnow says:

They both just edit CR’s script and Chihiro had all the same misses except the timing mistake.
Considering that the scripts are mostly the same and they both missed mistakes originating from CR, the main points of comparison would end up on typesetting and the OP/ED correctness+TL+karaoke. There doesn’t really seem to be much typesetting required in this show so I’ll say it’s mainly on the OP/ED.

Doki’s OP/ED has quite a lot of mistakes (it made me lol) while the Japanese in Chihiro’s actually seems correct (The TL could do with a bit of rewording but it was mostly good). So, if you care about the OP/ED and you’ll prefer a TL of those songs rather than some made up ones then you’ll want Chihiro’s. Even in the sections where Doki’s had the correct Japanese, their TL was a bit depressing…

Basically, Chihiro didn’t have that timing error plus they actual have a OP/ED done properly rather than putting together something just to make it look like they did it.

NSnow says:

Actually, there was a mistake in CR’s script at 19:14, which Doki didn’t fix and Chihiro fixed it but they stuffed up the timing for that line. The line was “I was helping out Hibino”, which is obviously incorrect even without a tlc. Chihiro fixed it but the subs disappear way too early. It looks like they first split the line into 2 but then later merged them back without fixing the timing.
So, it looks like they both had a timing error.

lygerzero0zero says:

Hmm… I’m not seeing your reasoning for the “whom”. What’s it the object of?

The way I understand it:

That person whom you saw -> you saw him; him is the object of “you saw” thus whom should also be in the objective case.

That person who you said ran away -> you said he ran away; it wouldn’t be “you said him ran away” because “he” is the subject of the indirect… indirect… dammit I’m forgetting my grammar terminology. In any case you wouldn’t say “you said him ran away” thus you also wouldn’t say “that person whom you said ran away”.

At least that’s my understanding of the rule.

Sean says:

That’s correct, lygerzero0zero. I suspect Dark_Sage had a knee-jerk reaction upon seeing “who you”, since a majority of the time, that ought to be “whom you”. But not this time.

Dark_Sage says:

What on earth are you talking about?

pokerface.jpg

Nohta says:

I see what you did there.

we34we says:

I found this funny because Doki edited the crap Crunchyroll shitted out (obviously on time pressure). Crunchyroll fixed their shit later. See http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=cmt&id=38130

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